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Re: amalanAthipirAn - 5

From: Venkatesan Ananth (
Date: Wed Sep 27 2000 - 19:46:10 PDT

Dear bhakthAs,

A question was raised based on one of adiyEn's 
comments on thiruppANAzhvAr's pAsuram, by a young 
devotee. She had asked it in a direct email, but I 
thought it made sense to reply to the forum for a 
number of reasons, the foremost being that adiyEn's 
ramblings can be corrected, if they need to be, by
the many learned members of this group.

>> pAramAya:
>> As nammAzhvAr said thonmAval vinaith thodar, 
>> so does thiruppANAzhvAr say pAramAya."Even when He 
>>                                       ============ 

>> removes them, they do not entirely leave us.
>> ============================================

> How is that true? Doesn't He have the Shakthi
> to eradicate all our Paapam.Andal also says
> Doosagum".Kindly explain me regarding this .

Here is my interpretation of my own statement.

AzhvAR used the "pAramAya" first denoting a heavy
burden and followed it with "pazhavinai" denoting
ancient karmAs. He could have used "pArmAya peruvinai"
to indicate the heaviness of the burden; instead
he chose ancient. adiyEn's understanding is that 
AzhvAr used it to indicate that these are timeless
karmAs. Our AcharyAs talk about these vinai being 
without origin ("anAthi") and that they will last 
till the end. He may remove them, but they tend to
come back to us or that we tend to go back to them
(having tasted them).

AzhvAr is stating next that He has removed even such
vinai for him ("paRRaRuththu") - not just removed
but removed AzhvAr's attachment to them.

In the second line, AzhvAr talks about "vaiththAn 
vaiththathanRi". That is, not only did He make AzhvAr
be attached to Him, but also entered his heart after.
That again was to make sure that the mind does not go 
back to these karmAs.

In later pAsurams, AzhvAr further delineates this. 
Will these karmAs come back? The example that they 
will come back is rudrA, who ended up with 
brahmahathyai and who had to have that dhOsham removed

by Him ("thuNdaveNpiRaiyan thuyartheerththavan"). 

Also, AzhvAr said He removed AzhvAr's ancient karmAs. 
But for them to be removed without an opportunity to 
arise again, the avidhyA that is their source should 
be removed. That avidhyA would create obstacles to 
prevent those associated with it from reaching Him. 
AzhvAr compares this to hiraNyAn creating obstacles to

prahalAda. And just as He ripped him to shreds 
("avuNanudalkeeNda") with His divine hands 
("thirukkaikaL"), so will He rip the avidhyA (with 
His "gnyAnakkaikaL").

By emphasizing that these karmAs tend not to leave us
or that we tend not to leave them (that probably is 
what adiyEn should have said in the first place), 
AzhvAr is making it clear that only He can remove 
these in their entirety. That is, yes they can be 
removed; and He and only He with His parama kAruNyam 
can remove them ("sarvapApEbhyO mOkshayishyAmi") 

nammAzhvAr also states the same thing, that not only 
He has to remove our karmAs, but also that He has to 
remove them from the root so that we may join Him, 
when he says

annALnee thantha Akkaiyinvazhi uzhalvEn
vennALnOyveeya vinaikaLai vEraRappAynthu
ennAL yAnunnai inivanthu kooduvanE

and also

.... nin 
panmAmAyap palpiRaviyil padikinRa yAn
thonmAvalvinaith thodarkaLai muthalarinthu
ninmAthAL sErnthu ...

I hope that clarifies what adiyEn had said. Please
let me know if there any additional comments.

adiyEn madhurakavi dhAsan
T.C.A. Venkatesan

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