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Does vibhutvam of ParamAtma negate the presence of jIvAtma and achEtana?

From: Anand Karalapakkam (
Date: Fri May 12 2000 - 09:41:35 PDT

SrI Lakshminrusimha ParabrahmaNE namaha
SrI Lakshminrusimha divya pAdukA sEvaka SrIvaN-
SatakOpa SrI nArAyaNa yateendra mahAdESIkAya namaha

 Dear devotees,
 namO nArAyaNa.

 adiyEn was going through some of the relatively recent 
 discussions/questions and saw the following one to be 

 SrI L.Harikumar presented  a question of his friend 
 (an advaitin), which in essence says that, If ParamAtma ie. 
 Brahman is infinite (vibhu), how come other tattvas like 
 jIvAtma and achEtana be really existing, since it will 
 contradict the infinite nature of Brahman. The argument is 
 that, if at all jIvAtma and achEtana exist really, Brahman 
 does not occupy those spaces occupied by these tattvas 
 and thus Brahman can't be said to be infinite (vibhu).

  Reply :

  The presence of chit (jIvAtma) and achit is not at all a 
  violation of the vibhutvam ie. all pervading nature of 
  ParamAtma. Your friend who objected that the very 
  presence of chit and achit violates Sruti in teaching us 
  that ParamAtma is infinite, is certainly not aware of 
  infinite mathematics. Also, there are scores of other texts 
  in Sruti which teach us the presence of chit and achit apart 
  from ParamAtma.

  We know that,  Infinity + 10 is Infinity.

  From it, we can obtain the result that Infinity - 10 is 
  also infinity.

    Proof : 
    Infinity + 10 = Infinity
    => Infinity + 10 - 10 = Infinity - 10 {sub 10 from both sides}
    => Infinity = Infinity - 10
    => Infinity - 10 = Infinity. {Switching over RHS and LHS}

  We know that Infinity + Infinity is also Infinity.
  From it, we can get the result that Infinity - Infinity is also 
  to be Infinity.

   The steps in the previous proof can't be strictly employed
   in this case, since  we can't cancel Infinity - Infinity to 
   be zero similar to how we cancelled 10 - 10 to be zero. 
   Moreover, adiyEn doesn't want to get into the subtraction of 
   Infinity from both sides.
   We need to know what is Infinity - Infinity. Lets assign
   x = Infinity - Infinity.

   Now,  Infinity + x = Infinity { according to the rule of 
                                   addition to Infinity ie.
                                   anything added to Infinity
                                   is again Infinity }.

   => Infinity + (Infinity - Infinity) = Infinity {expanding x}

   => (Infinity + Infinity) - Infinity = Infinity 

   => Infinity - Infinity = Infinity. {According to rule of 
                                       addition, Infinity + 
                                       Infinity = Infinity }.
   Thus, x = Infinity. 

   adiyEn (a non-mathematician) does not see any flaw in my proof; 
   But if it is there, adiyEn requests Mathematicians in the list to 
   kindly point it out. Anyway, the result that Infinity - Infinity 
   = Infinity is valid, and sophisticated proof(s) by mathematicians 
   might be there in their literature.
  Thus, eventhough chit and achit many occupy infinite space,
  ParamAtma can still be infinite. There is absolutely no
  contradiction. Thats the beauty of infinity and the infinite
  ParamAtma !!

  adiyEn rAmAnuja dAsan,

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