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Re: Origins of the Jiiva

From: Krishna Kalale (
Date: Tue Mar 16 1999 - 18:30:20 PST

Dear sri Krishna Susarla,

This is one of the issues in which the book "our original position"
published by ISCKON has quoted Sri Ramanujacharya and Probably Madhvacharya

According to all systems of vedanta (except the view held the ISCKON book
"our original position"), jiva's bondage is eternal ie. beginningless.  Jiva
was bound eternally from beginningless time.  theory of "falling from
vaikunta" is not supported by any system of vedanta.  "anadi mayaya suptaha
yada jivo prabudhyate" - state ment from "gaudapada karika" which states
that " when jiva awakens from the eternal beginningless slumbers of
ignorance or maya" is taken as valid in all other systems of vedanta.

In the 13th chapter for the verse - karanam guna sangosya sadasad yoni
janmasu (bhagavadgita) the issue of eternal previous births is suggested.  I
am sure the Ramanuja bhasya gives details here. Further in sribhasya there
are several passages to this effect.

Currently, due to lack of time, it is difficult for me to go further.  I
have had discussions with ISCKON members regarding this at length.

adiyen krishna kalale
-----Original Message-----
From: Krishna Susarla <>
To: <>
Date: Tuesday, March 16, 1999 5:42 PM
Subject: Origins of the Jiiva

>Hare Krishna.
>I am looking for statements by the Sri Vaishnava acharyas regarding the
>origins of the jiva. I understand that Sri Vaishnavas consider that the
>living entity's bondage in maya is beginningless, and that they do not ever
>speak of a "fall" from Vaikuntha.
>I would definitely appreciate if learned netters could either post
>statements by SV acharyas (especially Ramanuja) in this regard, or email
>them to me. Please include the name of the source from which the quotes are
>taken and verse numbers if possible.
>Of special interest are statements which explicitly refute the idea of
>"falling" from Vaikuntha, if any such statements are there.
>thanks in advance,
>-- Krishna