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Free-will vs Pre-determination -reply to sri Ram kumar

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jasn sn • August 12, 2002 


SRIMATHE RAMANUJAYA NAMAHA.

Sri Ram kumar says:-

>The jIva would reduce to an ontological absurdity 
>in viSishTAdvaita, if the brahman were completely 
>responsible for the jIva's gyAtRtva, kaRtRtva and
>bhOktRtva.

The replies given in blue colour
 (note: wherever the small s is used for self , it
denotes the jiva, as also with small b in brahman and
small l in lord .The big letter stands for the Lord,
Brahman)

>  What Ramanuja says:- (V.S. ¡V iv-13) 

¡§ He is at the time of creation possessed of that
characteristic volition which is peculiar to none
other than Himself and is to the effect ¡V¡¥ I  will
Myself become manifold in the form of endless
immovable and movable things¡¦, in accordance with His
volition, creation is characterised by a peculiarly
well defined arrangement of endless and wonderful
entities: the differentiation of endless names and
form results from the entrance of the individual self,
which has Brahman Himself for its self, into all non-
intelligent things: and all things other than (the
Brahman) Himself  have Himself for their basis, have
Himself for their abode, are capable of activity
through Himself, and are established in Himself¡¨

„«  Observation:- The above is  self revealing, I
suppose.
„« No question of ontological absurdity attributed.
„« The qualities (in jiva) are relevant  as they are
with the Brahman.
„«  But that they have been masked as how dust
envelopes the gem is being made out in the other
passage  quoted below.

The brahman by Its Will originally provides the jIva
with 
gyAtRtva, kaRtRtva & bhOktRtva.

„« The term ¡¥providing¡¦ is not used by Ramanuja.
„« For in his discussion on whether the Brahman, for
becoming ¡¥many¡¦, is split or divided and so on,  he
concludes that It permeates every thing.
„« As such Ramanuja finds no distinction between the
jiva and the Brahman.
„« The distinction  comes on account of the karmic
limitations  on the jiva and the commandment that it
can not initiate creation.

>Therefore the jIva, should *actively* utilize these
abilities 
>with the realization that these are provided by the 
brahman for brahman.
>ie the jIva learns, acts & experiences in the mood of
sAtvika-tyAga 
>in subservience to the brahman (remeber Sesha-Seshi
bhAva)

Now what Ramanuja says:-
¡§The Sutrakara speaks of the eternity of the self in
the following aphorism and in others, -¡¥the self is
not (a produced thing, as there are no scriptural
statements to that effect.¡¦ (Ved su, ii, 3.18) in the
aphorism-¡¥For that very reason (the self) is the
knower¡¦ ) (ved su, ii,3.19) ¡V by mentioning the self
to be the knower, he declares that it is natural for
the self to be the seat of intelligence. It has been
stated that there has been nothing wrong in that
(self), which is itself of the nature of intelligence,
being at the same time the seat of intelligence: just
as there is nothing wrong in gems and other similar
objects (although they are made up of the material
element of heat and light), being themselves the seat
of luminosity. We will establish further on that
intelligence, which of itself is unconditioned , is
capable of contraction and expansion.¡¨
„« The contraction and expansion is further explained
in terms of karmic limitations. 
„« It is made out that the ability to know, act and
enjoy are all in the nature of the jiva as a
manifestation of Brahman.
„« Upon destroying the limitations, he shines in
luminosity as the Brahman.
„« The limitations as caused by prakriti sambhandam
are extensively discussed by Ramanuja in many places
and this perhaps must provide the answer to Mr
kashyap¡¦s quiz as to how the prakruti becomes the
doer and not the jiva (BG). For jiva in the mould of
the Brahman, is eating the pippala fruit as long as
confined in material body, (due to prakruti
sambhandam) but  shines as the bird in splendour
without eating it,  upon liberation from limitations
(Ref:Mundaka) 
„« Another relevant passage that Ramanuja quotes
is-¡¥To whom who is and  has a body, there is no
destruction of the pleasing and  the unpleasing: the
pleasing and the  unpleasing touch not him who is and
has no body¡¦-(Chand) ¡V the body with prakruthi
sambhandam.
      
>sAtvika-tyAga = kaRtRtva-tyAga + mamatA-tyAga + 
phala-tyAga + phala-sanga-tyAga.

>kaRtRtva-tyAga = the ability to act is accorded by
the brahman.
>therefore I give up (tyAga) the notion that
'I am the independent doer'.

>mamatA-tyAga = give up ownership of the act.

>phala-tyAga = Offer the outcome (whatever it may be),
to the brahman.

>phala-sanga-tyAga = Give up attachment to choosing
*a* particular 
outcome out of many.

>'tyAga' in sAtvika-tyAga would be meaningless, if the
jIva were not
originally provided with gyAtRtva, kaRtRtva and
bhOktRtva 
by the brahman.

>In other words, the word, "tyAga" indicates that jIva
has to 
>*actively* utilize these provided capabilities, but
give up (tyAga) 
>notion these faculties were provided for its own
individual 
>gratification but rather for utilization in
Sesha-vRtti 
(active service) to the brahman.


>Otherwise the concept of jIva would reduce to the
passive 
>insentient (jaDa) 'achit' tattva like a stone or log
of wood.

„« Not said so by Ramanuja  and other purvacharyas
too.
„« The said three attributes of the jiva enable the
Brahman  to enjoy him.
„« A similar expression (log of wood) is used by
Nampillai to drive home the view that unless the Lord
makes him in his image, how can He enjoy him
(bhokhtruttvam). This bhokhtruttvam is once again not
due to the jiva¡¦s sva-nirbhandam. It is because
¡§Aanandham avan preethai thuLirezhuppa¡¨.- to make
Him enjoy and grow in preethi. Otherwise  it will be
like enjoying a log of wood.
„« Another relevant passage from V.S-(iv, 4.21)
¡¥And on account of the characteristic of equality
(between the individual self and the Supreme Self)
being solely confined to (the item of) enjoyment¡¦

>All veda-s, bhagavad-gIta and other sAStra-s are
addressed to
>the sentient (chit) baddha-jIva in order to guide it
to
perform dAsya-vRtti *actively* for the brahman.

>When was last time any of us starved in refusal until

>the brahman personally brought food? 

„« When was the last time any of us ate food that was
not given by Brahman?
„« If all the intelligent and the non ¡Vintelligent
embodiments and every being that is created owe their
existence to  Brahman and have Him as their self, how
can we ever eat  something that is not of Brahman or
not brought by Brahman?
„« To quote Ramanuja in agreeing with Bhaskara¡¦s
views of the abheda sruti, ¡¥ the fishermen are
Brahman, the slaves are the Brahman, and the gamblers
are also the Brahman: man and woman are also born out
of the Brahman, women are the Brahman and man also (is
the Brahman)¡¦ (Samhotopanishad)
„« And by an extension of this, Brahman exists in
plants, shrubs, creepers, grass etc - what Ramanuja
calls as material embodiments ( note -Ramanuja does
not negate the That thou art injunction giving rise to
this (above type of) all pervasiveness of Brahman ¡V
he qualifies this by interfacing with ghataka sruti). 
„« Therefore  all that we eat is Brahman, the maker of
the food (your wife or who?!) is Brahman
„« The Taittriya saama ghanam ¡¥ aham annadam¡¦ ¡VI am
the eater (in this context) of the food that is
Brahman and I am the annam (ref above ¡V
Bhokhtruttvam) for the Lord too is valid. ( this
passage is quoted by Ramanuja and Nampillai in the
course of their discourse)
„« We, as annam and annadam are constantly happening 
but without our knowledge (due to karmic limitations)
When we realise us as the annam and annadam and enjoy
that status,  we would have  perhaps lived through the
real import of gyAtRtva, kaRtRtva and bhOktRtva!

Inference:  The qualities of gyAtRtva, kaRtRtva and
bhOktRtva as such do not confer freewill, but exist as
an extension of Brahman in us!!


 
Jayasree sarnathan.

PS:-
#  The addition of avidya along with the three, as
discussed in the list in this context, can not be
taken as an attribute of the jiva as per the above
explanation.
#  Refutation of the advatic avidya apart. Ramanuja
uses the term avidya to mean ignorance arising out of
karmic limitations. This  and the reason why and how
evil can be found in created beings when the Brahman
is all pure, austere and auspicious only, constitute a
vast topic which might be taken up for discussion at a
later date and at an appropriate context.

JS




 



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